Wandering zero

A discussion about Turkey guns, rifles, black powder, handguns, chokes, cleaning, and accessories.
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howl
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Wandering zero

Post by howl »

Dark one at forty and light at 60. Y'all seeing this much variation? Or do I need to troubleshoot?
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Hoobilly
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by Hoobilly »

What gun?
Don't start none, won't be none!

https://foxtrotammo.com/
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howl
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by howl »

Yildiz 20 o/u, top barrel, Sumtoy 5625, big 20xl, T9s
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by Hoobilly »

howl wrote: March 12th, 2019, 1:49 pm Yildiz 20 o/u, top barrel, Sumtoy 5625, big 20xl, T9s
Well it’s not a 870 so it’s not a loose barrel. Have you made sure the base and site are locked down tight?
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GLS
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by GLS »

Did you first zero at 40 then shoot at 60 or vice versa?
Re-zero at 40, then see what 60 does. Great pattern at 60, however.
I had a wandering zero with an sbe. Turns out the reflex sight on the saddle mount was loose. It only cost me 2 birds until I figured out what was wrong. Zeroing was like dog chasing its tail.
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howl
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by howl »

Mount is bedded to rib, screws torqued down, sight screws still click torque wrench.

Zeroed at 20, checked at 40, adjusted, check top and bottom at 40, then top at 60. All shots were on except the top barrel at 40.

Only technical thing I see is the wad on that shot that was off had two petals that did not separate. I loaded some more with all petals manually detached.

We will see what the target says this morning.
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by RapscallionVermilion »

This is an interesting thread and something that isn't talked about much. I do wonder about the inherent ballistic accuracy of any of these loads and have come more and more convinced over the years that they aren't typically better than a couple of inches in any direction at 40 yards. So maybe not a big concern for hunting, but a possible pain for zeroing in a sight. Hard for me to say much more than that because I start to wonder about the limits of my accuracy off a rest, slight breezes, and things like that. But I've seen too many times when I can't explain the offset by something I did or the wind. The Federal HWTs with the flight control wad were the worst for me in that respect, and shorter barrels seem to be worse, so I wonder about the ballistics of the wads while the shot is still entrained, especially if something funky goes on with the wad, and interaction with the gases from the shell. Because some loads behave much better for me in my guns and chokes, I'm pretty sure now that this isn't all just in my head, although I really did wonder for a while.
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by BumbleFoot »

I experience similar to varying degrees with most all gun and load combos. It’s been enough to make me quit chasing minute-of-angle and instead be content with minute-of-turkey. After all, it is called a scattergun for a reason...
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howl
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by howl »

3 moa dot, 2 moa target, 10 moa pattern. I'm not sure what I am trying to do is within accuracy limit of the system. Getting such a light gun to recoil the same way each time for elevation is beyond me anyway.

The pattern is too tight, for sure. The bottom barrel with factory full is the one I will actually kill them with. Shoulda bought another full for the barrel instead of using the Sumtoy just cause I have it already.

Anyhow, I tried walking it in. Woulda killed the turkey no matter what, but... Then it occurred to me to get out the sight vise and do the one shot zero. Shoulda started there.
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by poorcountrypreacher »

It looks to me like the dot is near the center on both patterns; it's just that the most dense part of the pattern is varying. I think it is within what I would consider "normal" variation. I've recorded 10" numbers of from 260 to 300 on my primary hunting gun. I see variation in patterns that are similar to what you have here, and it has no problem killing turkeys if I aim correctly.

I saw a lot more pattern variation back in the old days of shooting lead. I think you are good to go hunting.
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by GLS »

I agree with all of the above. I zero the gun with one shot that I am positive the hold, sight picture, follow through are as good as I can do. I then adjust the dot to the center of the pattern. One can burn up a lot of shells trying to get exact repeatability. A dog chasing its tail for sure. The greater mystery is why the damn zero changes enough for mandatory re-zeroing the following year after sitting in the safe between seasons. I suspect that bouncing around on rough dirt roads affect the sight over the course of a season. It probably pays to check zero mid season and not wait for the "damn-if-I-know-what-happened" miss. Gil
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by willie »

GLS .i feel it takes a few shots to get barrel going again from season to season, like if you shoot a bow for awhile and then stop for the off season and when you start up again it takes awhile to get in the grove.My ml does that and i never change it and after about 10 shots it straightens itself out of i straighten out who knows.i believe if you change loads it takes the barrel and harmonics a few rounds to adjust.jmho.as far as shotguns flipping back and forth a LITTLE just remember how many components are PLASTIC IN A SHELL and under pressure i doubt it all performs the same each time.
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Jstocks
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by Jstocks »

I am having a hard time seeing any issue. I’d call it good and roll with it.
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by Spuriosity »

Jstocks wrote: April 8th, 2019, 7:27 pm I am having a hard time seeing any issue. I’d call it good and roll with it.
I agree. Go forth and kill turkeys.
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by WAGinVA »

I used to try to sight my gun in like a rifle, now I am using a 3 moa dot and a 4 inch square aiming point. As long as the 4 inch square aiming point is completely included in the densest 10 inch portion of the pattern in my annual sighting shot (at 40 yards) I call it good enough.
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Re: Wandering zero

Post by Sloppy_Snood »

Wind. 5-10 mph crosswind could drift your pattern at 40 yards an easy 1-2 inches (substantially more if it were lead shot).
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