Burris Fast Fires.....

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Spuriosity
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Spuriosity »

Thanks for coming over Burris Optics. I had issues with my SB mount, and you made it right. Your CS is beyond reproach, and I now own a FF II and FF III. I knew you would want to know about this issue, which is why I asked you to the party. I'm sure you and your fine company will get it sorted out.
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Burris Optics »

Spuriosity wrote:Thanks for coming over Burris Optics. I had issues with my SB mount, and you made it right. Your CS is beyond reproach, and I now own a FF II and FF III. I knew you would want to know about this issue, which is why I asked you to the party. I'm sure you and your fine company will get it sorted out.
Certainly a lot of familiar names over here that I hadn't seen in a while. I appreciate the heads up on this. I wouldn't have had a clue otherwise.
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Burris Optics »

poorcountrypreacher wrote:
Burris Optics wrote:
poorcountrypreacher wrote: Count me as another one that can't get a FF to hold zero. I bought a FF3 for the little Yildiz SXS 20 gauge, and William at SumToy figured out a way to mount it. His mount is rock solid and there is no chance it has moved, but the FF is all over the place. I have kept a record of the settings I used, and its now totally different from where it was originally. I have twice gone out to take the final shot and make sure it is zeroed, and both times found it way off from where it was the last shooting session.

And the arrows that show direction are wrong. The manual says that the arrows show the POI change, but they actually show the direction the dot moves. It was shooting high, but turning the dial down actually lowered the dot and made it shoot even higher. I had to turn the dial in the up direction in order for it to shoot lower. I dunno if the manual is wrong or the sight is backward. If it would hold zero it wouldn't matter.

I wish I had bought something else, but the mount is permanently attached, so I am stuck with it.
I just checked both the FF2 and the FF3. The arrow direction on both are correct.

The mount you have will most likely work with the Docter sight as well so you aren't stuck with the FastFire.
Burris, Thanks for coming over here and posting. I would have sent you a pm on OG, but they banned me the day I joined here, even though I hadn't posted over there in months. Glad you are here!

I don't know anything that could have moved my sight except the recoil of the gun. I have never carried it hunting, and it has only gone from the safe to my target range in my yard and back to the safe. I started to try to contact Burris earlier, but I never got around to it, and now we are 3 days from the season opening and its too late to change it. Plus, I bought it last year and I think my warranty is out. The good news is it is finally sighted in and I can look thru the sight and also see the front bead. The white line at the back of the FF allows me to line it up with the front bead and see where the POI should be if the gun shot straight. Mine doesn't, so the dot is to the right in the sight picture. I think I have the sight picture memorized now, so if it does move again, I should be able to notice it.

I don't know what to say about the arrow direction. My gun shot high several inches, so I moved it several clicks in the opposite direction of the up arrow, and that made it shoot higher. The manual said that the arrow indicates the change in POI, so moving it down should have moved the pattern down. I took the barrels out of the gun, put them in a vice, and watched thru the sight as I turned the adjusting screw. Moving the screw in the up direction makes the dot go up, moving the opposite direction makes it go down. I moved it 9 clicks up from the original position and it now shoots dead on. If you are interested in it, I can send it to you after the season is over. I don't want to take it off at this point.

Thanks again for coming over here. I am a Burris man and own a bunch of Burris products, and I certainly wasn't intending to bash the FF3. It is a great little sight if I can just get it to hold zero. It might help to know that mine was one of the first FF3 to hit the market, and I bought it before the season last year.
Now that I think about it the early sights were incorrectly marked. I forgot all about that. We fixed that right away so you must have gotten one of the first units.

Hmmm not sure why it's drifting like that but yeah I'd certainly take it from you and send you a new replacement. At the very least you'd have one with the correct arrow directions.

I'm not offended. I just want to get to the bottom of the issue. We've worked our asses off rebuilding our CS and QC reputation. It was quite awful when I got here. I certainly don't want it heading back in that direction. I'll keep everyone informed once we get into this.
drenalinld
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Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by drenalinld »

Thanks for addressing this head on Burris. I had a couple poor experiences with CS a few years back with a rangefinder and previous to that with with a shotgun/black powder scope that had half of advertised eye relief. After hassles, I haven't bought any more Burris products. Glad to see you guys working hard to restore reputation.
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poorcountrypreacher
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by poorcountrypreacher »

>>>Now that I think about it the early sights were incorrectly marked. I forgot all about that. We fixed that right away so you must have gotten one of the first units.
Hmmm not sure why it's drifting like that but yeah I'd certainly take it from you and send you a new replacement. At the very least you'd have one with the correct arrow directions.
I'm not offended. I just want to get to the bottom of the issue. We've worked our asses off rebuilding our CS and QC reputation. It was quite awful when I got here. I certainly don't want it heading back in that direction. I'll keep everyone informed once we get into this.<<<<

Thanks for telling me that about the early units; mine was one of the first you put out there and it has the 8 MOA dot. I paid above the retail price to get it, and planned to put it on my 12 gauge last season to replace the Bushnel Holosight. It didn't come in time to do it before the season, so I put it on the Yildiz this summer. It took me a few shots to figure out the arrows were wrong, but there is no doubt that they are wrong. It was no big deal once I figured it out, and I wouldn't send it back to correct something like that.

I will keep a close watch on the shifting zero; hopefully it was related to the fact that I kept adjusting it so much trying to get 2 barrels to have the same POI. Maybe now that I have quit changing the settings it will hold zero. I've got a tree picked out in the yard that I can now aim at and tell if its zeroed. From my porch, if I aim at the left base of the tree with the bead sight, the dot is on a limb in the center of the tree. If it ever moves, I should be able to detect it. Guess I could use a sheet of paper with measurements on it, but the tree seems to work ok. :)

Thanks again for the help.
turkey_slayer
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by turkey_slayer »

I haven't had any problems. I learned real quick that it would move when tightening the lock screws. Not much but enough to drive ya nuts. I adjust it and lock it down while watching the dot.
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by pullit »

Reloader wrote:Burris Optics,

1st of all, Welcome to GN! Good to see you on here.

If you'll search around, there's a bit of talk on the FFs drifting. I feel some can be with the mounts, but some is definitely the sights. I've done some swapping the past year with mounts and guns, but one of my FFs has been on the same gun for several years and it definitely drifts. The good thing is it's not much, but it's enough to cause my confidence with the gun to suffer. One of my friends had his drift 12" at 40yds on one gun, a few inches on another, and dead on with the 3rd FF equiped rig. Same loads and same chokes BTW. Also not factory load where components and lots can have an impact, these are very repeatable and consistent handloads. One of my turkey rigs wears a Nikon Monarch TP scope on a Weaver rail and hasn't moved since it was zeroed years ago FWIW. All of my guns have their trigger weights lightened and these results are from a bench rest at 40yds.

Thanks for the awesome support on this issue. As soon as I fire the gun I'm having the worst issues with this Friday, I'll let you know how it holds throughout the session. I will also pull out my FF1 and remount to see if it will hold, I've had issues with it moving as well.

Have a good one,

loder
Welcome and glad to see you here as well.

I am the one that Reloader is talking about on the being a foot off. I will say that I love my Burris FF's but hate the fact that I can not count on them from year to year.
I am glad to see that you are willing to look into this and see what is going on. It is not only the cost of the shells, time, and pain in the butt (or shoulder as the case may be) but like other have said your confidence level is just not there when you need it.
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Johndoe
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Johndoe »

Class act right there. Can you remind us of your name. I cant remember back to the OG days.

John
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There are no numbers on any of my clocks below 8. Then all of a sudden, 2 days before turkey season they appear. Then right after the season they disappear.
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chatterbox
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by chatterbox »

Johndoe wrote:Class act right there. Can you remind us of your name. I cant remember back to the OG days.

John
His name is Mart Noller. Mart WILL make it right. There is no one I would rather have looking into this then him.
You guys can rest assured. Mart really cares, and he will get it fixed.
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GLS
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by GLS »

He helped me with a problem with mine; a self-inflicted problem. ;)
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Andy S.
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Andy S. »

Johndoe wrote:Class act right there
I agree 110%. Thanks for addressing these issues head on.
Last edited by Andy S. on March 13th, 2013, 12:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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pullit
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by pullit »

Mike and I have talked and all I can say is GREAT CUSTOMER SERVICE. Burris has had my business for years and will keep my business for years to come.

Thanks for your help in this matter.
Last edited by pullit on March 13th, 2013, 1:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Ricochet »

Great to see Burris on here! I have a FF1 and it's been an accurate red dot for me on my 870 super mag shotgun for the past 3+ years. I recently moved it to my kid's 870 20ga. and had some issues zeroing it in but I finally remembered what I needed to do, and I think it is good to go now. I moved the FF1 to the youth shotgun since I got a FF3 for my main turkey gun. I got it zeroed in but it wasn't easy - adjusting the windage was confusing for me...maybe since I was use to the FF1 versus the FF3 and their respective adjustment steps or I was misreading the arrow markings. :dontknow:

Is there a video out there showing proper windage adjustment and/or zeroing in with a FF (I searched with no luck)? If not, can y'all do a video like that when you are testing people's FFs? Thanks for the great CS in advance!
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by pullit »

Ricochet wrote:

Is there a video out there showing proper windage adjustment and/or zeroing in with a FF (I searched with no luck)? If not, can y'all do a video like that when you are testing people's FFs? Thanks for the great CS in advance!
It would be nice to know approx how far one full turn of the adjustment screw moves the POI in both windage and elev. at 40 yards. That way you can get a good guess as to how much you have moved it or need to move it.
I.E. 1 full turn = 8" of movement, so if you were off 6" you would need approx 3/4 of a turn.
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Andy S.
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Andy S. »

Add me to the group of unlucky ones. I mounted my brand new FF3 on a speedbead mount (12 gauge Rem 870 synthetic) last week and shot it for the first time this evening. To start, I left my Magnum Gobble Dot sights on my vent rib to use as a point of reference for the red dot (getting the windage and elevation real close before my first shot). I adjusted the red dot to where it aligned perfect with my gobble dot sights, which are nothing more than rifle sights with TruGlo fiber optics that are easy to see. I started out shooting high brass squirrel loads at 30 yards to check POA/POI, and my target was 36"X36". I would shoot my gun, lay it down on the ground, walk to my target, put another target up and then walk back to my gun, sit down, shoulder it, look through red dot sight, etc. Three out of the six shots, my red dot moved enough that I could tell with my own eyes when I shouldered the next time, and it moved substantially the last two times of the six, like ten clicks on the elevation. My very last shot was a hard kicking 3.5" MagBlend and it really caused the red dot to shift an unbelievable amount. I shot the MagBlend, laid my gun down, walked down to the target, put a new target up and came back and shouldered my gun and the red dot was literally pointing at my rear sight base, way way low compared to where it was just two minutes ago when I shot the MagBlend. That was enough for me. Furthermore, I had to move the elevation and windage adjustments on my last three shots just to get it back close to my Gobble Dot Sights, which are stationary and not moving, that's for certain. I packed all of my stuff up and came to the house. I can honestly say there is nothing worse than not having confidence in your gear. I am shipping back to Amazon tomorrow for a refund. This is not a slam on Burris by any means, just thought that it was worth sharing with the group.

Burris Optics - here are a few pics I snapped of my FF3 box if you want to try and get your hands on it for testing at a later date. I am not sure what Amazon will do with it once they receive it, but figured I'd at least make you aware and try to give you a chance to look into the matter further.

Image

Image
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Burris Optics »

No it doesn't help me much. Having it sent to me and allowing me to refund you for it would have been nice because then at least I'd be able to see what the problem is. It sounds like I have one on the way already so no worries. Hope you get setup before the season starts.
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Andy S.
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Andy S. »

If time would have been on my side, I would have sent it to you and let you refund me the money, however, I was in a hurry to get something setup by middle of this week, so I sent it back to Amazon and they emailed me yesterday that they had refunded my money. I look forward to hearing your report on the other FF3 you are having sent to you. Quick question here, where is the Fastfire 3 made/assembled?
Andy S.

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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Byhalia »

Just receiced my FF III with a speadbead for SBE II.
I will shoot it soon....hope I do not have the same problem.

Welcome Burris Optics.......
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bird
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by bird »

I would be curious to know what shell people are shooting that are having trouble with drifting such as factory load and which factory load and if handloads are being used also.

Along with that I would also be curious of how the scope is mounted to the gun such as Marlin 336, weaver base or saddle mount.
Odumbass "Liar In Chief"
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Andy S.
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Andy S. »

Hmmmmm......I was told the FastFire III was made in the Philippines by a Burris customer support person earlier today on the phone. Thanks for clarifying this for me.
Last edited by Andy S. on March 18th, 2013, 1:34 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Burris Optics »

The FF sights are all made in China. They are made in the same factory as many other sights that cost a lot more but look a lot like the FF.
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Spuriosity »

Finally got a fairly calm afternoon and shot my 1187/FF II/TSS combo. It hit right where it did at the end of last season when I put it in the gun safe. I wasn't planning on shooting it this year (shooting the O/U). But it is my backup gun, and this thread got me worried. Glad I only had to burn one shell.
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ccleroy
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Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by ccleroy »

You just can't beat this company's customer service.....it's amazing.
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Burris Optics »

Andy S. wrote:Hmmmmm......I was told the FastFire III was made in the Philippines by a Burris customer support person earlier today on the phone. Thanks for clarifying this for me.
I was wrong. They ARE made in the Philippines. I just verified that with our VP.
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Andy S.
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Re: Burris Fast Fires.....

Post by Andy S. »

Burris Optics wrote:
Andy S. wrote:Hmmmmm......I was told the FastFire III was made in the Philippines by a Burris customer support person earlier today on the phone. Thanks for clarifying this for me.
I was wrong. They ARE made in the Philippines. I just verified that with our VP.
That is great news to me, thanks for following up with the clarification. Now I just may have to try another FF3 as I was a little skeptical with hunting with anything that involved Chinese craftsmanship as well as Chinese QA/QC. I have been plagued with more than my share of Chinese crap over the years (trail cameras, binoculars, etc). Thanks again.
Andy S.

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