Land Between the Lakes - Quota Hunt Input (contact info)

[Southern Sportsman]

It has been posted in another thread, and those who like to hunt LBL are probably already aware:

The spring turkey quota hunts have been suspended this year at LBL. They typically have three quota hunts - a youth only hunt the first weekend in April then weekend hunts the second and third weekends in April. After the last quota, it is open for general public access for two weeks. The quota application period is usually the month of February. Last week they posted the following on their website:

"There will be no draw hunt this turkey season. At the request of many turkey hunters, we will not conduct a turkey draw hunt this season in order to give all turkey hunters an equal opportunity to enjoy a traditional opening day experience. Many turkey hunters expressed an interest in hunting fresh uneducated birds. We are suspending the turkey draw this season to provide this unique experience. Points accumulated in previous seasons will carry over to next season when we return to normal draw hunts.
Kentucky Turkey Hunt Season April 18-30, 2020
Tennessee Hunt Season April 18-23, 2020 and April 24-30, 2020"

They have had these quota hunts at LBL for as long as I've been around. For years it has been 100% draw with 1 priority point - meaning anyone can hunt the first weekend (after the youth hunt) every-other year, and everyone can hunt the two "open" weeks every single year. But they took away 30% of the hunting days, including a designated youth hunt, to appease a few people who whined about not being the first ones to hunt "uneducated" turkeys on a 170,000 acre tract of federally owned (US Forrest Service) public land. And they did so without any public notice or comment that I am aware of.

I have a lot of thoughts on it. I'm not particularly mad about it. In effect it will reduce the gobbler kill and substantially delay the kill that does occur which I think is a good thing given current population trends. Also, I'm not sure I believe their justification. I have a hard time believing that division under the United States Forrest Service makes management decisions like this based on the complaints of whiners who have the same opportunities as everyone else. Turkeys there are tough to kill. But blaming that on or being upset by other hunters "educating" turkeys on federally owned public land is moronic. But that's their story and their sticking to it. And taking away hunter opportunities on public land to appease a few people who whined about public land turkeys being “educated" by others is too stupid to ignore.

After asking around for answers, John Westbrook (LBL "Environmental Stewardship Department Manager") has advised that they are keeping "a call log of hunter input." It feels a little like "let's just change it and see if anyone calls to complain." But, for lack of other options, I will call and complain. Though others might want to as well.

270-924-3615

[joey46]

Thanks for the info. I hope that those going to the NWTF convention this week will make these shenanigans known to the attendees. You could be at the LBL south entrance in about 90 minutes from Opryland. Nothing beats in person contact with a bureaucrat. Dumping a long established Youth Hunt/Quota Hunt to appease "whiners" is unheard of. Many other options, and prior public comment, should have been considered before taking this drastic step. This really stinks.

[Southern Sportsman]

One thing I hope people keep in mind. LBL is federally owned and managed. The KY/TN state wildlife agencies and commissions have nothing to do with it. So direct displeasure to the correct people.

[joey46]

Letting this go unchallenged sets a bad precedent for all the millions of acres of National Forest and BLM lands also federally controlled. If KY and TN were
blindsided by this it is federal arrogance at best. If no more than a way to postpone, what many consider a biologically unsound too early start to the LBL season it was handled miserably.

[decoykrvr]

Environmental Stewardship Department Manager ------- As a former Federal Biologist, I can only opine that only the Feds could concoct such a B.S. title and this smacks of "The easiest way to eliminate work and responsibility is to eliminate the causative factors." In other words, eliminate the hunts and the problem and potential work goes away. If you only direct your concerns and ire to LBL it will be totally buried and ignored. You need to contact the US Forestry Service, NWTF, and your members of Congress and request a directed response from them. At a time when almost all of the bonafide hunting organizations are working to try and recruit new, young hunters, the elimination of "Youth Hunts" makes no sense. This action by LBL will be noted by other Federal Managers with similar situations and needs to be "Nipped In The Bud."

[decoykrvr]

I recently spoke w/ some folks at the US forestry Service Headquarters primarily concerning the elimination of the Youth Hunt. They asked me if I knew why the hunt had been canceled, but assured me that it would be investigated and that I would get a reply. "The squeaky wheel gets the grease."

[Realwarrior]

I have contacted LBL, TN NWTF and KY NWTF. I have emails from John Westbrook. He has refused to answer my questions in email. and avoiding my phone calls.The nwtf WAS NOT involved or consulted. As a retired Fed Leo, with a B.S. Degree in Biology who worked for the USFS early in my career, I have a keen awareness of the Federal regulations. The USFS ifs suppose to file Status of Proposed Action (SOPA) Reports, for public input, as part of the National Environmental Policy Act (NEPA). LBL's SOPA's can be found at fs.fed.us/SOPA/forest-level.php?110860
If you look through these you will see that changes to the Quota Hunt was never proposed or addressed.
You can look at the LBL Annual and Biannual Monitoring and Evaluation Reports (M&E) reports. The FY16/17 M&e report Goal #5, Q5.11- states " Deere & turkey hunting participation is declining. Section E. Action plan states " we will conduct area wide assessment... We will collaborate w/public to review our natural resources. The next report was to be available Sept 30, 2018, but as of yet I've been unable to obtain a copy.
In an email from Steven Beam, NWTF regional biologist, he states "I work very closely with LBL on some habitat projects but NWTF was NOT involved in the recent change to the Quota hunt and youth hunt.". Mr. Beam further states "The seasons will go back to the normal structure next year and NWTF fully supports that. Turkeys are doing very well at LBL".
The overall management of LBL's resources is governed by the 2004 Land and Resource Management Plan. In Part 2, Strategy, Recreation Mgt., Supporting Strategies, it states " Emphasize hunting & fishing opportunities that provide quality Recreation experienced that are safe and meet wildlife Mgt objectives.
Part 2, Communications Mgt., Primary Strategies....ALL OF THESE WERE DISREGARDED as they pertain to the QUOTA Hunts.
In Appendices, V. Monitoring Summary Table, Task #1, Goal #1" Has the FS made progress toward providing satisfactory recreational and Environmental Ed. Experiences to visitors while providing for resource stewardship?" To be reviewed annually. I have been unable to obtain the results of this annual review.
The bottom line is that this was done underhanded, without regard for the regulations that govern the process, as is seen in the absence of the SOPA. I have no problem with changes that are scientifically based, but these weren't. My First question was " Are these changes scientifically based or pandering to special interest groups?" As a retired LEO, I'm All for enforcing laws and regulations, at the same time as Govt servants, we have a responsibility to administer the laws and regulations, whether or not we agree with them. Circumventing the laws and regulations, and skirting the responsibilities in administering them in unacceptable.

[Southern Sportsman]

I dug into the regulations, though not as deep as you. But you don’t have to go far to realize this wasn’t done on the up-and-up. And I don’t know a single turkey hunter who would prefer 30% fewer hunting days a single opening weekend free-for-all over three well-structured quota hunts (including the youth hunt) with virtually 100% draw opportunity with 1 pp, followed by a 2 week open season. NOTHING about it adds up.

Honestly, it feels like somebody just screwed something up. Forgot to pay an online vendor that handles the IT for the application process, forgot to submit some bureaucratic form necessary to finalize something, forgot or failed to so something. Then got to February and had an “oh sh!t” moment when they could no longer get it set up in time. Then concocted this ridiculous “at the request of many hunters . . . uneducated turkeys. . .” “But we’re going right back to the old system next year” story in an effort to cover it up.

[joey46]

Thanks to all who followed up. This should give pause to other bureaucrats who may want to concoct their own policies on federal lands. The National Forest and BLM holdings will be the public land hunters last stand. No compromise should even be considered.

[decoykrvr]

Repeated calls and messages to John Westbrook, LBL Environmental Stewardship Department Manager, have gone unanswered. Who is John Westbrook's supervisor and who within The USFS has oversight responsibility for LBL?

[Realwarrior]

I dug into the regulations, though not as deep as you. But you don’t have to go far to realize this wasn’t done on the up-and-up. And I don’t know a single turkey hunter who would prefer 30% fewer hunting days a single opening weekend free-for-all over three well-structured quota hunts (including the youth hunt) with virtually 100% draw opportunity with 1 pp, followed by a 2 week open season. NOTHING about it adds up.

Honestly, it feels like somebody just screwed something up. Forgot to pay an online vendor that handles the IT for the application process, forgot to submit some bureaucratic form necessary to finalize something, forgot or failed to so something. Then got to February and had an “oh sh!t” moment when they could no longer get it set up in time. Then concocted this ridiculous “at the request of many hunters . . . uneducated turkeys. . .” “But we’re going right back to the old system next year” story in an effort to cover it up.

Wouldn't be there first time!

Error with paperwork removes LBL from UNESCO program
By JASON MORROW, jmorrow@paducahsun.com

Seventeen sites - including Land Between the Lakes - have been recently removed from the UNESCO World Network of Biosphere Reserves program.

According to LBL's newly named Environmental Stewardship Staff Officer John Westbrook, the area was removed because of a failure to submit the program's re-instatement paperwork while he transitioned into his current position.

"Information was not sent to the appropriate individuals as a result of this timing," Westbrook said. "Therefore, Land Between the Lakes was placed on the program's list of probable departures."

Read the full story at:
Error with paperwork removes LBL from UNESCO program
By JASON MORROW, jmorrow@paducahsun.com

Seventeen sites - including Land Between the Lakes - have been recently removed from the UNESCO World Network of Biosphere Reserves program.

According to LBL's newly named Environmental Stewardship Staff Officer John Westbrook, the area was removed because of a failure to submit the program's re-instatement paperwork while he transitioned into his current position.

"Information was not sent to the appropriate individuals as a result of this timing," Westbrook said. "Therefore, Land Between the Lakes was placed on the program's list of probable departures."