Are turkeys going the way of the quail

A general discussion area for turkey hunters.
coconut
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by coconut »

I have seen the same thing and would also like to mention how much better the camo , guns , ammunition, blinds , calls and YouTube instruction is than it used to be.
silvestris
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by silvestris »

old5beards, you are at least thinking about the possible causes. On one possible cause, it appears that the Primos’ et al, the NWTF, and the Utube hunters have achieved their apparrent goal of filling the woods with new hunters, albeit with little left to hunt.
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OLE RASPY
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by OLE RASPY »

There’s MORE hunters nowadays
TURKEYS
COYOTES
DEER
SQUIRRELS
(all in this order)
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ole5beards
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by ole5beards »

Here’s something else that I’ve alwsys thought about as well when it comes to talk about declining turkey numbers. We all have a network of turkey hunters that we talk to or with regularly during the season. We’ve already established that there are more hunters in the woods in the spring now than ever before, so when we hear about a lack of gobbling or sightings of birds they usually come from within that network. I can’t speak for all of you, but I know for certain that a big majority of guys in those networks, are newbies to the sport, and some of their information isn’t exactly accurate. There’s some guys that hunt more during the week and not so much the weekends and vice versa. Guys that will go to a spot and not hear a peep, and leave for another spot or head home way too early, and not stick around long enough to know the rest of the story. I know gobbling levels ebb and flow during the season, and there’s times where we are in a lull, and really don’t hear squat. Here’s another thing I’ve noticed talking to others over the years, they might say that they aren’t hearing much but upon further investigation, you find out that they are hearing birds, but those birds they hear only gobble once or twice, and that’s not enough for them to count. I’ve noticed the last 7-10 springs as well, that early season has slowly gotten worse as far as hearing birds gobble. I’m still hearing birds gobble early season, and honestly I’m still hearing a good many different birds each morning, but they aren’t gobbling much at all, maybe a handful of times on the roost and that’s it until later in the mornings, when a lot of hunters have already given up by then so they aren’t around to hear or know if birds gobbled later in the mornings. Here in the southeast, especially ny area of central Bama, the winters are getting warmer, this past winter was colder compared to years past but it still wasn’t a COLD winter. So we have warmer days in January and February which in my opinion, means you have birds start gobbling earlier, and by the time our season opens up on March 15th, the gobbling is and or has peaked and we open up the season in a Lull as far as gobbling goes. And that leads a lot of hunters to report they aren’t hearing much, but just because you aren’t hearing much does that necessarily mean that there are fewer birds? There are a TON of factors to take into consideration when it comes to this. Based off of my experiences alone, I do feel and believe that the numbers are down and have been down in this area for a while, it definitely hasn’t gotten any better. However, I’m curious to know just how much they’re down, I’d like to see studies and data that the state and feds have done over the years and see what they’re thought process is.
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coconut
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by coconut »

I know for me gobbling activity isn’t the only way I gather information on how many turkeys are in an area. I look for tracks in the mud holes or tracks on soft dirt, dust bowls , feathers , strut marks , droppings , scratching areas and sightings. I don’t think some of the inexperienced hunters ever use this information or can even recognize some of it. Not putting them down, it’s just one of those things that comes from someone teaching me when I was very young and years of experience. The one thing the young guys can beat me doing is setting up one of those dang game cameras. Things got to dam many buttons and options.
Roy
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by Roy »

It’s crazy how things have changed. I’m sitting here and thinking about it and man.....times just change I guess. I do know gobblers were very vocal and still can be. I have said this and said this back when we would talk about this same thing on old gobbler. My grandfather used to say how hunting pressure changed spring gobbler. IDK
" Y'all keep discussing it among yourselves...I'm sneakin' in to pop the noisy one. " - Stinky J Picklestein
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ole5beards
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by ole5beards »

coconut wrote: May 2nd, 2018, 6:21 pm I know for me gobbling activity isn’t the only way I gather information on how many turkeys are in an area. I look for tracks in the mud holes or tracks on soft dirt, dust bowls , feathers , strut marks , droppings , scratching areas and sightings. I don’t think some of the inexperienced hunters ever use this information or can even recognize some of it...
Exactly. But the same ones are the ones saying how the numbers are way down?!
Pass the biscuits!!
ncturkeycaller
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by ncturkeycaller »

Ok fellas, here’s my $.02. This is just an opinion but it is based on 35 years of turkey hunting and the last 20 of it has included extensive travel. I usually hunt 5-8 states per year and try to hunt at least one new to me area per season. My home base from 1998-2017 was in an area of NC that had exceptional numbers from 1998-2006. Every year from 2006 to the present the numbers have steadily declined. Counties where you used to see 20+ bird flocks regularly you are lucky to see 20 total in a season. Now I know everyone has different opinions on what is causing the decline in their area but I know for a fact that blaming coyotes is NOT the answer. It is a small part yes but not the main reason. I have seen farming practices change drastically in my area and I think for me this is the main problem. Farmers are prepping a vast majority of the crop fields by spraying roundup or a version of it on these fields and killing every living thing on them and then drillling the seed. Now, turkeys use to be seen EVERY day in these agricultural fields. It is a rarity now to see birds. If it kills every living thing on these fields, how good can it possibly be for the wildlife that uses these fields? Now, On to the travel side. There are areas in states that are BOOMING with turkeys right now. I hunt Texas and Oklahoma every season. Both areas of these states that I hunt have more coyotes than they do people and the turkey numbers are crazy good so I poo poo the idea that coyotes are killing all our birds. I feel like The southeast for the most part is where I’m seeing the biggest decline by far. These are the states where the habitat has changed the most. Farming practices/logging, several wet spring seasons, it’s the perfect storm for losing our precious resource. I spend around 45-50 days in the turkey woods every season and log thousands of miles so this is not the opinion of a part time woodsman. I have question several game wardens/game biologists in NC and other southeastern states and not one of them has had an answer to the problem so it may be several years before the problem is diagnosed. My advice is to be as loud a voice as you can be in your area. Like I said, some states are doing great, some are in real trouble. I look forward to hearing from some more fellas that log serious hours in the turkey woods. Please share your stories and opinions as well
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howl
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by howl »

Heard Mr. Bob in another location today. That's a lot for me. I predict that if the economy continues to recover and the timber business gets back into full swing, gobbler numbers will come back.
coconut
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by coconut »

Anyone mentioned hogs yet? Seems like there population is booming. To what extent if any are they having on turkeys?
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ccleroy
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by ccleroy »

ncturkeycaller wrote: May 2nd, 2018, 10:50 pm Ok fellas, here’s my $.02. This is just an opinion but it is based on 35 years of turkey hunting and the last 20 of it has included extensive travel. I usually hunt 5-8 states per year and try to hunt at least one new to me area per season. My home base from 1998-2017 was in an area of NC that had exceptional numbers from 1998-2006. Every year from 2006 to the present the numbers have steadily declined. Counties where you used to see 20+ bird flocks regularly you are lucky to see 20 total in a season. Now I know everyone has different opinions on what is causing the decline in their area but I know for a fact that blaming coyotes is NOT the answer. It is a small part yes but not the main reason. I have seen farming practices change drastically in my area and I think for me this is the main problem. Farmers are prepping a vast majority of the crop fields by spraying roundup or a version of it on these fields and killing every living thing on them and then drillling the seed. Now, turkeys use to be seen EVERY day in these agricultural fields. It is a rarity now to see birds. If it kills every living thing on these fields, how good can it possibly be for the wildlife that uses these fields? Now, On to the travel side. There are areas in states that are BOOMING with turkeys right now. I hunt Texas and Oklahoma every season. Both areas of these states that I hunt have more coyotes than they do people and the turkey numbers are crazy good so I poo poo the idea that coyotes are killing all our birds. I feel like The southeast for the most part is where I’m seeing the biggest decline by far. These are the states where the habitat has changed the most. Farming practices/logging, several wet spring seasons, it’s the perfect storm for losing our precious resource. I spend around 45-50 days in the turkey woods every season and log thousands of miles so this is not the opinion of a part time woodsman. I have question several game wardens/game biologists in NC and other southeastern states and not one of them has had an answer to the problem so it may be several years before the problem is diagnosed. My advice is to be as loud a voice as you can be in your area. Like I said, some states are doing great, some are in real trouble. I look forward to hearing from some more fellas that log serious hours in the turkey woods. Please share your stories and opinions as well

I've always said, "No Till" farming as you are describing is a detriment to turkeys using an area. In fact prior to 2005 you would see many more birds using ag fields but not now if at all. Hens have to bug during the spring and they aren't bugging in fields that have been killed where there is no green for bugs to eat. All the fields I do see turkeys in are still turned over like they were prior to the no till craze.I also feel chicken manure has to play a roll in turkeys numbers. There are a number of other variables impacting the numbers such as habitat reduction, hunter numbers,predator numbers and lack of predator management etc.


PS- I'm not hating on farmers, I know the no till practice saves fuel which saves money. I'm just stating my observations.
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kythunter
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by kythunter »

I heard Eddie Salter talk about this recently at a local sporting goods store in Kentucky.
He made a good point, he said that insects are a large part of a wild turkeys diet and now days a lot of pesticides are being sprayed in fields where they weren't before. He specifically mentioned Alabama where green fields that used to hold turkeys you no longer see them. It makes sense no insects in the fields no turkeys.
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ccleroy
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by ccleroy »

Exactly
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okiefowler
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by okiefowler »

A lot of the quail issues around me are because of the prominant use of Bermuda and fescue used for grazing/haying in the cattle industry instead of native grasses. Over grazing, is another issue since quail need old growth bluestem for nesting.


Been managing my little patch of ground for quail since '99 and kept at least 5 covey on a full section in bad years with 10-12 covey in good year.

NW Kansas has had a boom in quail numbers, 10-13 covey a day weren't uncommon and was a glimpse into the past golden years of bird hunting. My GSP's sure enjoyed it.

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ole5beards
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by ole5beards »

kythunter wrote: May 3rd, 2018, 2:46 pm I heard Eddie Salter talk about this recently at a local sporting goods store in Kentucky.
He made a good point, he said that insects are a large part of a wild turkeys diet and now days a lot of pesticides are being sprayed in fields where they weren't before. He specifically mentioned Alabama where green fields that used to hold turkeys you no longer see them. It makes sense no insects in the fields no turkeys.
This.
Pass the biscuits!!
Roy
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Re: Are turkeys going the way of the quail

Post by Roy »

ole5beards wrote: May 3rd, 2018, 3:59 pm
kythunter wrote: May 3rd, 2018, 2:46 pm I heard Eddie Salter talk about this recently at a local sporting goods store in Kentucky.
He made a good point, he said that insects are a large part of a wild turkeys diet and now days a lot of pesticides are being sprayed in fields where they weren't before. He specifically mentioned Alabama where green fields that used to hold turkeys you no longer see them. It makes sense no insects in the fields no turkeys.
This.
Good point. But, Im sure like u guys have seen I have seen birds pick a lot more than insects in a field
" Y'all keep discussing it among yourselves...I'm sneakin' in to pop the noisy one. " - Stinky J Picklestein
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