Long Beard haters and why???

[turkey_slayer]

Do people get the same sense of accomplishment as shooting one out of a blind or over a decoy versus without? Or shooting 2 birds at 20 one with tss and one with lead out of a 410?

I don't know. Can't speak for other folks, and I try not to sit in blinds over decoys, not for me. But I do have a 410 that will kill to almost 50 yds. TSS vs factory load 410 kill at 20 yds, I would feel like I accomplished more with the factory load. With our fairly short season and 2 bird limit, I just couldn't make a commitment to the 410 without tss. There's something about the thought of a bird hanging up at 30 and having to watch him walk away I just can't cope with. And I don't go around pounding my chest or bragging because I hunt with a "410". I know that 410 is as good as or better than any 12 gauge I ever shot with traditional lead loads.

I totally agree!

[Johndoe]

Do people get the same sense of accomplishment as shooting one out of a blind or over a decoy versus without? Or shooting 2 birds at 20 one with tss and one with lead out of a 410?

I don't know. Can't speak for other folks, and I try not to sit in blinds over decoys, not for me. But I do have a 410 that will kill to almost 50 yds. TSS vs factory load 410 kill at 20 yds, I would feel like I accomplished more with the factory load. With our fairly short season and 2 bird limit, I just couldn't make a commitment to the 410 without tss. There's something about the thought of a bird hanging up at 30 and having to watch him walk away I just can't cope with. And I don't go around pounding my chest or bragging because I hunt with a "410". I know that 410 is as good as or better than any 12 gauge I ever shot with traditional lead loads.

I fully understand that POV, I have my first gun ever a Stevens SXS FandF that screams TSS.. But for the life of me cannot understand why anyone spends extra money loading more than 1 1/4 - 1 5/16 of the stuff even in a 12 gauge..

I hear you Tom. But once you are there it's only 30 to 60 cents for the rest.
It also can be more hassle to load lighter loads because TSS takes up so little space.

[ICDEDTURKES]

I hear you Tom. But once you are there it's only 30 to 60 cents for the rest.
It also can be more hassle to load lighter loads because TSS takes up so little space.

You make 2 extremely valid points as to why to load it heavier than that but neither points are the reason folks load heavier.

[Johndoe]

Well to a degree. Most loads come from Hal. Most are heavier. There are a few lighter but take powder that most don't use because powders are hard to find. They want powders used in multiple loads.
Loads with great pattern numbers are most popular but not cause only TSS shooters want them. Longbeards shooters are also in love because of numbers. If Longbeards were only 150/200 patterns, but very consistent, no one would be singing so loudly.
Now I'm not trying to say they are not better than other lead. They are. But the love affair is no different than the HTL.
Now. If I were to return to lead I would do 1 of 2 things. I would open my choke up for Longbeards or shoot old lead with tight chokes. I have shot the Longbeards. I am speaking with experience. They leave big holes just outside the 10". Now the 20" is not the end all for everyone, but to dismiss the pattern just outside the 10 as unnecessary is surely not a good idea.

[Jamey]

I fully understand that POV, I have my first gun ever a Stevens SXS FandF that screams TSS.. But for the life of me cannot understand why anyone spends extra money loading more than 1 1/4 - 1 5/16 of the stuff even in a 12 gauge..

I agree and shoot the lightest load that Hal shared with me for my 20 but it is still 1-7/16 in a 2-3/4" shell and in my opinion is way overkill. I don't experiment with my own loads and don't intend to as I trust the recipes that I have been given to be safe. I am moving toward using my 410 more and just got a new 28 that will kill one this season too but my little 20 is likely to be my main turkey (over)killer for many years to come.

[pedro]

I fully understand that POV, I have my first gun ever a Stevens SXS FandF that screams TSS.. But for the life of me cannot understand why anyone spends extra money loading more than 1 1/4 - 1 5/16 of the stuff even in a 12 gauge..

Most people see the big number patterns and what they are capable of and then just gotta have it. If you stick with the small stuff no need to go more, if larger size shot is your fancy then larger payload are needed for sufficient pattern densities. if i worried about the money aspect of hunting, it is hard to justify any of it. my fuel to bird ratio will always dominate over my shell to bird ratio. But I too think no need for anymore than 1 5/16 of tss, that is why the 28ga seems so perfect. Hope mine gives a good pattern with the factory choke, other than that it will need to have a custom one made.

[GLS]

One advantage of a larger than needed payload for the 10" ring is a better margain of error with more pellets in the 10"-20" ring than with lighter load. With the 20 gauge and tss, I don't go above 1 5/8 oz., but will shoot less weight. In regards to expense, I will gladly supply shells to someone who will pay my gas bill during the season. Gil

[ICDEDTURKES]

One advantage of a larger than needed payload for the 10" ring is a better margain of error with more pellets in the 10"-20" ring than with lighter load. With the 20 gauge and tss, I don't go above 1 5/8 oz., but will shoot less weight. In regards to expense, I will gladly supply shells to someone who will pay my gas bill during the season. Gil

Unlike most everyone on here I will run 87 to save a few pennies in my truck knowing I may get un needed performance from premium.

[MKW]

Do people get the same sense of accomplishment as shooting one out of a blind or over a decoy versus without? Or shooting 2 birds at 20 one with tss and one with lead out of a 410? I would bet a lot of guys using tss aren't busting birds at distances it's capable of.

I don't know if they feel the same sense of accomplishment or not. I've never done it. But, I can tell you that it diminishes their accomplishment, in my eyes. It's the same when I read about guys killing turkeys with 28s and 410s with TSS. I think, "So, what, it shoots like a 12ga."
Not trying to make anybody mad, but that's how I feel. On the same note, I feel no extra accomplishment at all for myself because kill everything with a 20ga. Been doing it for years. No big deal cause it's a capable weapon...without TSS.

[GLS]

Mike, If I understand you correctly, you miss the point. The folks I know shoot .410's, 28's and, yes, 20's, not to impress anyone, and say "hey, look at me" but shoot them so that they don't have to carry 8 lbs. or more of a 12 gauge shotgun and experience 50 foot-pounds of recoil shooting 2 oz. of lead to have the same pellet count. Your point about "diminishes" can be made by about anyone shooting Nitros, Hevi-Shot, or HW-7's out of a 20 gauge. Carries like a 20, but shoots like a 12, but as you say, no big deal.

[MKW]

Mike, If I understand you correctly, you miss the point. The folks I know shoot .410's, 28's and, yes, 20's, not to impress anyone, and say "hey, look at me" but shoot them so that they don't have to carry 8 lbs. or more of a 12 gauge shotgun and experience 50 foot-pounds of recoil shooting 2 oz. of lead to have the same pellet count. Your point about "diminishes" can be made by about anyone shooting Nitros, Hevi-Shot, or HW-7's out of a 20 gauge. Carries like a 20, but shoots like a 12, but as you say, no big deal.

I have seen thread titles several times with the gauge listed in the title. Why is that if they are not saying "hey, look at me."??
As for it going the same for guys shooting the other HTL stuff out of a 20ga, I agree %100. No big deal...for me or anybody else that kills turkeys doing that.
None of this really matters. Y'all shoot what you want, I'll shoot what I want. If both result in a dead turkey, one is not better than the other...and everybody is happy.

[ole5beards]

I don't know if they feel the same sense of accomplishment or not. I've never done it. But, I can tell you that it diminishes their accomplishment, in my eyes. It's the same when I read about guys killing turkeys with 28s and 410s with TSS. I think, "So, what, it shoots like a 12ga."
Not trying to make anybody mad, but that's how I feel. On the same note, I feel no extra accomplishment at all for myself because kill everything with a 20ga. Been doing it for years. No big deal cause it's a capable weapon...without TSS.

Exactly my thoughts. I understand TSS in smaller guages, it allows a hunter to tote a lighter gun and there isn't any good factory loads for .410's or 28ga. It levels the playing field. But most of these 410 and 20 ga patterns are better than most 12ga patterns, and to me it's all the same. I've killed turkeys with a 410 the hard way, no TSS, does that make me the "Man", No, but knowing my maximum effective range was 25 and knowing I had to get the turkey under that yardage made it more of a challenge than shooting him at 40 yards. I believe everyone of us could do that, I'm not saying ones better than the other but killing turkeys at 40-45 yards with 410 and 20ga, using TSS is no different to me than using a 12ga. I don't load shells, I don't have the time and money right now, but if i did I would imagine it would be as addictive as anything else I do, and I would probably do it as much and as often as the others that do. So I understand the obsession behind the madness. It's like fanning, any Joe Schmo could grab a fan, a gun and some camo and go fan a turkey up close and shoot it, doesnt look like my kind of fun. Where's the challenge? If you really wanna do something fan a bird as close as possible and try to reach up and grab him alive, now that'd be challenging! Again don't wanna piss any of you TSS guys off but that's my take on it.

[appalachianassassin]

One advantage of a larger than needed payload for the 10" ring is a better margain of error with more pellets in the 10"-20" ring than with lighter load. With the 20 gauge and tss, I don't go above 1 5/8 oz., but will shoot less weight. In regards to expense, I will gladly supply shells to someone who will pay my gas bill during the season. Gil

Unlike most everyone on here I will run 87 to save a few pennies in my truck knowing I may get un needed performance from premium.

im in the same boat.

[GLS]

I have seen thread titles several times with the gauge listed in the title. Why is that if they are not saying "hey, look at me."??

Perhaps to distinguish the thread from other threads such as "Hey, look at what Mike sent me." Gil

[Reloader]

But I think alot of the new folks coming here and asking advice are in it for one reason..

Surely it's not to shoot past 40.05yds?

[MKW]

I have seen thread titles several times with the gauge listed in the title. Why is that if they are not saying "hey, look at me."??

Perhaps to distinguish the thread from other threads such as "Hey, look at what Mike sent me." Gil

No need to get personal...but, I guess that's why they do it. I can't help what other people post about me. I don't tell them to do it. Actually, it puts unwanted pressure on me.
Everybody(me included) wants their, "Hey, look at me moment." It's human nature, especially with a competitive group like turkey hunters. That's what these forums are all about. The turkey hunting strategy portion on all these turkey forums is very small. It's mostly about killing turkeys with what you can buy instead of what you can learn.

[Stinky J Picklestein]

Y'all got this guy thinking about trying TSS now...

[SCtrkyhntr]

Y'all got this guy thinking about trying TSS now...

[ole5beards]

That's hilarious!!

[gobblegobblegobble]

I try to promote the TSS idea as much as I can, 99% of turkey hunters have never heard of it. I just think it's awesome that you can get such great performance out of a small-bore gun. I'm not recoil-shy, but I HATED shooting my 3.5" 12 gauge. Lots of kids being introduced at younger ages, too.

I was out of the hunting scene for probably 10 years up until 3 or 4 years ago. I didn't think there would be so many technological advances in things such as turkey guns... boy was I wrong!

[turkey_slayer]

Y'all got this guy thinking about trying TSS now...

This is what we should all do. Go back to Indian era and make our own equipment. Whose going to be the first to post a pic wearing a loin cloth holding a dead gobbler?

[devastator]

Y'all got this guy thinking about trying TSS now...

This is what we should all do. Go back to Indian era and make our own equipment. Whose going to be the first to post a pic wearing a loin cloth holding a dead gobbler?

LOL,I first started killing birds in 1982 with 8 shot out of a 16 gauge,then a moss 500 with win.4 copper,then the big 835 came along and WOW did the hammer come to the shoulder,missed a few birds from flinch.Switched back to a 3" in another 12 with the said 4 shot and hammered lot's of birds.NEVER used to shoot at paper,get the gun ,get the shells and go hunt'n, kill birds.Move forward to the computer age and guess what,every spring im pulling out 4 guns and shooting at targets every year with the best factory shell i could buy,Fed HW 7 in all gun's! and i have them shooting great in all the guns,MY choice!!I have seriously thought about loading my own until seeing some of these Win longbeards patterns.I use reloads for rifle and get a satisfaction out of loading my own,factory shot pretty good out of them rifles also,to each his own,
On a side note,I LOVE to read the reloading section to see what you MEN are coming up with next,and may get ahold of Hal in the next few years!

[gaswamp]

Mike, If I understand you correctly, you miss the point. The folks I know shoot .410's, 28's and, yes, 20's, not to impress anyone, and say "hey, look at me" but shoot them so that they don't have to carry 8 lbs. or more of a 12 gauge shotgun and experience 50 foot-pounds of recoil shooting 2 oz. of lead to have the same pellet count. Your point about "diminishes" can be made by about anyone shooting Nitros, Hevi-Shot, or HW-7's out of a 20 gauge. Carries like a 20, but shoots like a 12, but as you say, no big deal.

Gil there are lightweight 12ga shotguns under 6 pounds and opnr could shoot a 2 3/4 load that would not be heavy recoil.

[FloppinTom]

LOL I like shooting a 16ga with TSS. I really can't get a factory turkey load that will come close to the TSS loads. Im forced to suffer shooting TSS, no winchester longbeards, no hevi-shot just lead.
Im getting the vibe there may not be long beard haters here but there may be some TSS haters.

[FloppinTom]

LOL I like shooting a 16ga with TSS. I really can't get a factory turkey load that will come close to the TSS loads. Im forced to suffer shooting TSS, no winchester longbeards, no hevi-shot just lead.
Im getting the vibe there may not be long beard haters here but maybe some TSS haters.